“I study every day, and exercise because I'm not about to be outdone by anyone yet”
”I study every day, and exercise because I’m not about to be outdone by anyone yet”
On a magnificently sunny Seville winter day, maestro Juan Peña “El Lebrijano” chatted with us near his house in the Macarena neighborhood. He had just come from his rehabilitation exercises and looked quite good. He arrives humming, and before beginning the interview he says he feels ready to sing again and is looking forward to doing so, a sort of triumphal return, stronger than ever.
Q. Flamenco fans are anxious for news about your illness, so the first thing on the agenda is, how are you feeling? A. Right now I’m quite well, the thing is I’m not singing until March 13th, everyone knows I’ve had health problems, I’ve had three major operations and now I’m trying to reinforce my abdominal muscles.
Q. Those must have been difficult moments, how did you stand up to it? A. I had a hard time because two of the operations were very big, and I still haven’t gotten it out of my head, I wake up in the middle of the night in a panic thinking about the sickness that I thought was going to take my life, but all I’ve done is try to get better, because thank God it turned out not to be that serious, so I’m recuperating well. You know…all that about not being able to sing, having to rest, no stress, following the doctors’ orders to get well without having a relapse…
Q. You had appearances scheduled at the Bienal de Flamenco de Sevilla that had to be suspended. How did you feel about that? A. Well, it really hurt, it’s a bitter pill to swallow, you see all your friends working there… I also had the responsibility of presenting the work “Cuando Lebrijano Canta, se Moja el Agua”, and I wasn’t able to, but in the end I have to count my blessings because it turned out not to be so bad, and that’s a great relief. But I sat out the Bienal taking it easy, I wasn’t in condition to go to any of the shows, and in actual fact, I don’t know how it went, although friends and critics called me and I got some news from them about how it was going.
Q. Recently, your latest work “Cuando Lebrijano Canta se Moja el Agua” was given the Demófilo prize of the Fundación Machado. How do you feel about this? What do prizes mean to you at this stage of your career? A. Prizes are always welcome, at any stage of life. You always receive prizes as something special, even more so considering the importance of this one, coming from where it comes and thinking what the father of the Machados means to Spanish and flamenco culture. Another source of pride, is that this is a recording for which I just planted the seed, and my nephews Dorantes and Pedro Peña, as well as the rest of the musicians, did great, it was a complicated job fitting that prose to cante verses.
Q. I believe you weren’t able to direct this work as you did with previous projects. How did the recording go? A. A difficult recording, because it came at a time when I was getting sicker and sicker. I began strong, but then realized I couldn’t do it, and when I put my voice to the last piece I told my nephews to finish it off. I trusted them, because I know their concept, and also they know my taste well, and they know cante and music even more than me, and there you have the finished product. I’m very pleased, and I hope flamenco fans will enjoy it and treat it benevolently.
Q. Although you didn’t participate in the production or the arrangements, does this record still sound like “El Lebrijano”? A. Yes…totally. Take into consideration that I planted the seed, and they took care of the rest, and a fine job they did too, but the essence is mine.
Q. In your acceptance speech of the Demófilo prize you said that various works of yours were considered crazy, but with the passing of time they were recognized and accepted. What was that like? A. It’s true, just think, when I recorded “La Palabra de Dios a un Gitano” sometimes people would boo me off stage because I used a symphony orchestra, that was in 1971, and they thought it was some kind of joke, then it happened again when I worked with Arabic musicians on the record “Encuentros”, and with “Ven y Sígueme” with Manolo Sanlúcar and Rocío Jurado, “Casablanca”, “Lágrimas de Cera”…it’s part of the game, it’s always been that way, and it’s not going to change.
Q. But when you offer a new work and people are opposed to it, what does that feel like? A. I couldn’t understand it, but people were so turned off, there was a time no one called me for festivals because they said I’d betrayed who knows what cause. Over the years these works have been accepted, and I have the satisfaction of knowing I did what I felt, without worrying what anyone might think. And there aren’t that many people who understand flamenco, they just wouldn’t accept anything that was mine, if it had been anyone else, they’d have a monument next to to the cathedral.
Q. During this year they’re going to celebrate the centennial of the birth of Antonio Mairena, you knew him well, what sort of relationship did you have with the maestro? A. We had a very good relationship, but the problem is Antonio didn’t want to be surrounded by good singers, that’s the gospel truth. He only made room for people who couldn’t touch him. In those days there were singers like Terremoto, Chocolate and a couple of others, he didn’t want any of us around, while others, and I won’t name names, were protected and promoted. That’s why my friendship with Antonio deteriorated with time, although I’ve always admired him. I remember when I made “La Palabra de Dios a un Gitano” and “Persecution”, he said who was I anyway to take to take the gypsies’ dirty laundry into the street, so I told him, with all my respects, a people without history has nothing. But I know, because intimate friends have told me, he liked it, and a lot.
Q. Looking back at records like “Persecución”, or even one piece that protested Pinochet’s dictatorship and where you defend human rights, do you consider yourself a performer with political conscience? A. I believe performing artists have to defend minorities. Among other reasons, because we are a minority, and we have a privileged platform. Although we sing for everyone, we have to support the weak.
Q. A lot of people today believe cante has lost its direction. What does El Lebrijano find lacking? A. I miss hearing people sing flamenco, because it seems they’re singing something else. I think a lot of people singing today have no idea how Antonio Mairena sang, or Niña de los Peines, or Caracol, they don’t even have a conscience, they just open their mouths and sing, hoping their record will be a hit, depending only on their voice, whereas cante requires voice, head and heart. They follow Chacón’s system which is “to sing, you need three things: voice, voice and voice”, but I don’t think that’s sufficient to achieve powerful emotion.
Q. Are you familiar with the new batch of singers? How are they doing? A. There are some young people in Jerez, Utrera, Lebrija and other places who are coming on strong, but if they think they have nothing to learn, they’re lost. You have to listen to the old maestros over and over. Study, study, study, look at me, 67 years old and there are still mysteries of the cante I can’t fathom.
Q. What’s the most recent thing you learned about cante? A. That’s it’s very fragile, and it’s not that easy to fuse it. You have to know it inside and out to go down those paths.
Q. You’re a man who’s been travelling all your life, and you’ve been with many people who must have left their mark on you. What does El Lebrijano still have of Lebrija? A. I have many things from Lebrija: the compás, the childhood memories of a house that was a natural conservatory with master classes from the greatest singers of the era…many things. Most especially I remember the cante of my mother, La Perrata. Also Pastora Pavón, whom I admire tremendously and who taught me so much…Antonio Mairena, my uncle Perrate, Borrico… I learned from all of them, but with that starting point, I do my own thing with my own personality.
Q. What does El Lebrijano have in store for us? A. I’m planning to record the end of next year, but I can’t reveal those plans yet.
Q. A lot of people would like to see you do some more orthodox cante. Are you considering doing anything like this? A. I know, and it’s on my mind. When I make this next record, there will definitely be soleá and siguiriyas to make flamenco fans happy.
Q. There are those who say El Lebrijano isn’t what he used to be, his voice isn’t in form…what do you think about that? A. They’re right, I’m 67 years old, and I started singing at 17. How am I going to have the same voice I had as when I was 40? I have the voice I have, but I have much more experience and I’m more of a singer. When you’re 35 you don’t know about shading, vocalization, manipulating the tempo, it takes time. Look, I study every day, and exercise because I’m not about to be outdone by anyone yet. The day someone comes along who sings better than me, I’ll throw in the towel [he laughs]…just joking.
Q. What’s the best thing about being a performing artist? A. It’s a cruel life, and at the same time, wonderful. The best part, in my case is when you sing well one night and then you go to bed and say to yourself “I was great tonight!” It’s very satisfying.
Q. And the worst? A. When you sing badly and you can’t sleep all night.
Q. What do you ask from life? A. Health, health, health and solidarity between all people.
Thank you, maestro. Good health and good luck to you.
